Interesting. Thank you.
My takeaway
no herd immunity possible
there should be a universal mask mandate
we are f****d
Prime example of the fact vaccines are working. This is being framed terribly by the media. Saw this today below:
A village has 100 people.
99 of them vaccinated. 1 is not.
2 people become sick with Covid, 1 of whom is the unvaccinated person.
Media: “50% of cases occurred in the vaccinated!!”
This is what we’re seeing, and it’s irresponsible reporting.
Sorry Hadi, I do not agree. This is really bad.
I hear ya, just curious what you would do now that most of us are vaccinated? Masks for how long? .0001 have died that have been vaccinated and tested. Not sure what folks want to see? Zero?
Hadi I agree and disagree. We are seeing irresponsible reporting from media sources…right AND left. Worse we are seeing irresponsible reporting from our health agencies and frankly from our president and governors. The latter is feeding the former
Unfortunately it’s headlines on social media that’s causing the issues.
Good morning, Dr.S. I hope today finds you feeling better.
I have read your article post a couple of times and don’t know whether to laugh or cry. Our health agencies not only need a spokesperson but also need writers. Or w mindset adjustment.
The header says it all. The agencies were as surprised as anyone that the outbreak in Ptown was among and caused by the vaccinated. It takes a bit for that to sink in.
Yes, the vaccine is working but it is not working as they expected or assured us it would. That is ok ….if they are honest. The following in italics are direct quotes. The full caps are my comments….I’m not yelling. I’m just making it clear that my comments are not part of the article. The ellipsis indicate words I omitted to shorten this post.
…vaccinated people can spread the disease, the extent to which they contribute is not yet clear. Walensky said this week that such transmission occurs on “rare occasions.” IT IS NOT CLEAR YET SHE CAN CATEGORICALLY STATE IT IS RARE
…Massachusetts has a high vaccination rate and yet the virus was still able to spread. THIS IS WHAT IMO SHOULD BE SETTING OFF ALARMS
THE FOLLOWING TWO PARAGRAPHS ARE STUNNING …THE NEWLY REVISED GUIDANCE, KNOWING WHAT HAPPENED IN PTOWN, WOULD NOT HAVE STOPPED THE OUTBREAK THERE
Jennifer Nuzzo, an epidemiologist with the Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health, noted that the new CDC guidance on indoor masking for vaccinated people applies to communities with substantial transmission. That criterion would not have included Provincetown, which, according to the CDC report, had no reported new cases on July 3.
“What this tells us is we need much more context and better data to guide whether and when vaccinated people should wear masks because following CDC’s new guidance wouldn’t have stopped this outbreak from occurring,” Nuzzo said.
The headlines are particularly worrying because headlines alone are what people tend to read. I found this article through twitter and this is what twitter users saw on trending: https://ibb.co/KN9hn4p
From that little blurb alone you get unvaccinated people thinking “well, vaccinated people are getting covid so I shouldn’t get the vaccine.” Feels like an irresponsible headline even though factual. I hate the need to dumb down headlines for the general populace buuuuut…
(Also I’m doing a little bit better, still fighting this off. This is still far more tolerable than when I had strep throat. That was the worst!)
I’m glad you are feeling better. I made Panera chicken lemon orzo soup this am and was thinking I wished I could get some to you.
I absolutely agree. I had a rant…one of many lately… yesterday on here about the several ways we are in part the cause of unvaccinated numbers.
The unfortunate part is people hear what they want. It is human nature. Even vaccinated people are of the mindset that they can go anywhere and do anything and be fine.
I guess I believe that the vaccines are doing exactly what they we were told and expected. It’s not a cure, as with many upper respiratory illnesses it’s about mitigating serious illness and death. Life has to chug along, we need to figure out a way to get people vaccinated.
I always liked Walensky prior to her being appointed head
of the CDC. Once there, she became a different person.
I have lost all respect for her. Sorry.
I’ve lost a lot of respect for several but right now, she is simply double taking. And sadly, folks are listening. It is human nature I think to want to hear positives in the middle of something difficult….even if the positives are wrapped with negatives.
I have two concerns with breakthrough infections. 1. Severe illness among fully vaccinated who are immunocompromised. For example, cancer, HIV, and kidney patients, among others. 2. Breakthroughs can and do transmit. The evidence from Israel, Singapore, the Netherlands, UK, and now the US is overwhelming. Among new infections at least 10% are breakthroughs (LA County is now reporting ~20% of the most recent cases as being breakthroughs), and they’re passing from vaccinated to vaccinated, as well as to unvaccinated, essentially perpetuating the transmission chain.
The biggest source of transmission remains the unvaccinated, to be sure. But, we delude ourselves if we think that being vaccinated is a free pass. It’s not. It’s why I think it’s really foolish that healthcare entities, such as pharmacies, allow no masks and no distancing. Makes no sense. To reiterate, the tiny, cramped CVS I go to has a lot of outpatients from MGH (including the cancer center) who get their Rx’s filled. Many are immunocompromised. They’re all vaccinated. But, they’re definitely vulnerable.
Joshua, does your cvs have delivery? Perhaps that is too difficult in Boston. Many our this way do. I have same day delivery at no charge. I can add anything I Need to the cart, not just scripts
My CVS, which is in Boston, DOES, indeed, deliver. We have been getting our prescriptions delivered since the beginning of the pandemic. Of course, we order other items online that are delivered as well.
Note: We are not downtown. That may make a difference.
I presume Joshua’s CVC is that big one on Boylston Street with 2 floors near the Hancock and Copley Square. Of course, I do not know.
That is what we have here. I sure don’t understand cvs not having a mask mandate.
Totally agree. And I might add one more to you list. Those 65 and older are very susceptible to more severe illness due to the fact
that the human immune system simple does not function as well as we age, especially past aged 65.
I hope the Delta wave is the last of the waves. But hope is not something to rely on, in life, and in public health.
My worry at this point is that the virus is getting increasingly better at evading vaccines. Vaccines still work very well against severe illness, but even there efficacy has dropped at least 10 points in the past few months. We don’t want it to go much below 80%, at least not with the numbers of cases we have worldwide. And, it’s clear efficacy against contracting the virus has dropped significantly, by at least 35 points.
By having >100,000 cases in the U.S. yesterday (with 50% of the testing we did in the spring!), we’re just inviting the next variant to develop. And not just here. The next variant could be worse than Delta.
Oh, I believe it is not a case of if, but rather when. Likely soon imho. And what will that variant bring. scares the shit out of me!!
People who think this is winding down are delusional.
The CVS I’m talking about is across from Charles/MGH T stop. It used to be Phillips Pharmacy many years ago.
They do have a delivery service, but it’s not very good. Twice my son tried having his meds delivered through them and they did not come through on time. Could also be a function of the poor postal service.
In any case, it’s a really nice CVS in some ways. I like the pharmacists and also the cashiers. But, I find the lack of masks and distancing disconcerting when there are so many patients who get their Rx’s filled there. It’s one of two neighborhood go-to pharmacies upon discharge from the MGH, or getting an Rx from a doctor at one of the outpatient clinics. They do vaccinations there (I get my flu shot every fall there) in a tiny corner. When getting vaccinated masks are required. But, then the person 1 or 2 feet away from the vaccination area doesn’t have to wear a mask. Nonsensical.
Yes, I know that one as well.
I’ve gone to that one many times (mostly 10 or more years ago) and pretty much always on July 4. 😉
It certainly is. I keep hearing it compared to chicken pox. I was young when I had them. My kids were also. I wasn’t aware that they were more contagious than the other childhood diseases.
I heard on the news this morning that the UK is back open for business and that cases are down 50%. All pubs and restaurants open with no mask wearing indoors. All back to normal, at least that’s the impression I got.
Joshua, could this be us again by fall?
Joshua, your CVS that you posted yesterday (them & now) looks quite large to me. The one I sometimes go to on Beacon St. in Coolidge Corner, THAT is small to say the least. They don’t even carry certain items. Inside it’s about the size of a neighborhood corner store.
Can anyone explain Florida to me? Let me be a bit more specific. I thought that they were only reporting Covid numbers weekly. But on Worldometers, the new cases for the past four days are:
July 27: 12,775
July 28: 16,038
July 29: 17,589
July 30: 21,683
Are these numbers right? Are they reporting a backlog?
Great question. Florida doesn’t report on a daily basis. But once they do report Worldometer and others can sift through the numbers to report what Wednesday’s numbers were, Thursday’s, Friday’s, and so on and so forth.
Thanks Joshua. So these are daily numbers, but they might be from last week? If so, I hate to think what the current situation is.
Good grief. I hope those are not the number of new cases each day
Philip, the CVS store I’m talking about is really small. Even smaller than the one you’re referring to on Beacon Street in Coolidge Corner. My CVS doesn’t carry MANY items, just way too small to do so. It has the feel of a small neighborhood corner store.
You asked about the UK. Its cases have come down in the past 10 days, by about 30%. Hospitalizations are still very elevated in all regions except Scotland. Deaths in this wave have not been nearly as high as in previous waves, but at 75/day it’s much higher than the 5/day they were experiencing at the beginning of June.
UK is mostly back to normal and has been since May. A further lifting of restrictions occurred 2 weeks ago. Masking is NOT mandated, nor are proofs of vaccination or negative tests. But, masks and vaccine passports of sorts are customary in most indoor places. My daughter can confirm that. Also, there hasn’t yet been a return to offices, at least not on a large scale. Travel restrictions also apply and are quite stringent, as I’ve mentioned before.
Philip, the US has been FAR more open than the UK throughout the pandemic, and especially in the past 7 months. Essentially the UK is now where we were 2 months ago in terms of reopening, but with more voluntarily imposed restrictions than we have. So, I was confused when you said “could this be us again by fall?” We’re as open as can be, quite frankly. More so than any other industrialized country I know. The Delta variant hasn’t changed that at all.
Vicki, those case numbers are the daily increases in Florida. Test positivity approaching 20%. >10,000 hospital admissions, which looks like it will break the record set by the January surge in hospitalizations. 108 deaths reported today. That number will accelerate. This is very bad news, and preventable.
If we start comparing the U.S. with other highly vaccinated countries that have faced or are facing a Delta wave, we do quite poorly in terms of hospitalizations and deaths. There’s a clear reason for that: Our vaccination campaign was never systematic. It was “let’s throw paint against the wall and see if it sticks.” Hence, the opening up of vaccines to anyone over 18 long before other countries had done so. What the other countries wanted to ensure before they offered vaccines to everyone was that the >65, but also the at-risk groups 65 group. The U.S. isn’t even close to that goal nationwide for the >65. It’s around 81%, and even among the higher risk groups outreach was fragmented and so larger percentages of those people are unvaccinated in the U.S.
For some reason a sentence fragment was unintentionally deleted before I sent my post. Here’s the complete sentence:
“What the other countries wanted to ensure before they offered vaccines to everyone was that the >65, but also the at-risk groups 65 group, and healthcare workers were very well protected, that is, >95% fully vaccinated.”
C-19 / 8-1 / ready.
Comments are closed.
Your no-hype southeastern New England weather blog!
Bringing this article from the previous post over https://www.seattletimes.com/nation-world/nation/cdc-study-shows-three-fourths-of-people-infected-in-massachusetts-covid-19-outbreak-were-vaccinated/
Interesting. Thank you.
My takeaway
no herd immunity possible
there should be a universal mask mandate
we are f****d
Prime example of the fact vaccines are working. This is being framed terribly by the media. Saw this today below:
A village has 100 people.
99 of them vaccinated. 1 is not.
2 people become sick with Covid, 1 of whom is the unvaccinated person.
Media: “50% of cases occurred in the vaccinated!!”
This is what we’re seeing, and it’s irresponsible reporting.
Sorry Hadi, I do not agree. This is really bad.
I hear ya, just curious what you would do now that most of us are vaccinated? Masks for how long? .0001 have died that have been vaccinated and tested. Not sure what folks want to see? Zero?
Hadi I agree and disagree. We are seeing irresponsible reporting from media sources…right AND left. Worse we are seeing irresponsible reporting from our health agencies and frankly from our president and governors. The latter is feeding the former
Unfortunately it’s headlines on social media that’s causing the issues.
Good morning, Dr.S. I hope today finds you feeling better.
I have read your article post a couple of times and don’t know whether to laugh or cry. Our health agencies not only need a spokesperson but also need writers. Or w mindset adjustment.
The header says it all. The agencies were as surprised as anyone that the outbreak in Ptown was among and caused by the vaccinated. It takes a bit for that to sink in.
Yes, the vaccine is working but it is not working as they expected or assured us it would. That is ok ….if they are honest. The following in italics are direct quotes. The full caps are my comments….I’m not yelling. I’m just making it clear that my comments are not part of the article. The ellipsis indicate words I omitted to shorten this post.
…vaccinated people can spread the disease, the extent to which they contribute is not yet clear. Walensky said this week that such transmission occurs on “rare occasions.” IT IS NOT CLEAR YET SHE CAN CATEGORICALLY STATE IT IS RARE
…Massachusetts has a high vaccination rate and yet the virus was still able to spread. THIS IS WHAT IMO SHOULD BE SETTING OFF ALARMS
THE FOLLOWING TWO PARAGRAPHS ARE STUNNING …THE NEWLY REVISED GUIDANCE, KNOWING WHAT HAPPENED IN PTOWN, WOULD NOT HAVE STOPPED THE OUTBREAK THERE
Jennifer Nuzzo, an epidemiologist with the Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health, noted that the new CDC guidance on indoor masking for vaccinated people applies to communities with substantial transmission. That criterion would not have included Provincetown, which, according to the CDC report, had no reported new cases on July 3.
“What this tells us is we need much more context and better data to guide whether and when vaccinated people should wear masks because following CDC’s new guidance wouldn’t have stopped this outbreak from occurring,” Nuzzo said.
The headlines are particularly worrying because headlines alone are what people tend to read. I found this article through twitter and this is what twitter users saw on trending: https://ibb.co/KN9hn4p
From that little blurb alone you get unvaccinated people thinking “well, vaccinated people are getting covid so I shouldn’t get the vaccine.” Feels like an irresponsible headline even though factual. I hate the need to dumb down headlines for the general populace buuuuut…
(Also I’m doing a little bit better, still fighting this off. This is still far more tolerable than when I had strep throat. That was the worst!)
I’m glad you are feeling better. I made Panera chicken lemon orzo soup this am and was thinking I wished I could get some to you.
I absolutely agree. I had a rant…one of many lately… yesterday on here about the several ways we are in part the cause of unvaccinated numbers.
The unfortunate part is people hear what they want. It is human nature. Even vaccinated people are of the mindset that they can go anywhere and do anything and be fine.
I guess I believe that the vaccines are doing exactly what they we were told and expected. It’s not a cure, as with many upper respiratory illnesses it’s about mitigating serious illness and death. Life has to chug along, we need to figure out a way to get people vaccinated.
I always liked Walensky prior to her being appointed head
of the CDC. Once there, she became a different person.
I have lost all respect for her. Sorry.
I’ve lost a lot of respect for several but right now, she is simply double taking. And sadly, folks are listening. It is human nature I think to want to hear positives in the middle of something difficult….even if the positives are wrapped with negatives.
Tune for today: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zyErpmqpH_o
Sorry. meant this for the other blog.
It’s nice here too 🙂
I have two concerns with breakthrough infections. 1. Severe illness among fully vaccinated who are immunocompromised. For example, cancer, HIV, and kidney patients, among others. 2. Breakthroughs can and do transmit. The evidence from Israel, Singapore, the Netherlands, UK, and now the US is overwhelming. Among new infections at least 10% are breakthroughs (LA County is now reporting ~20% of the most recent cases as being breakthroughs), and they’re passing from vaccinated to vaccinated, as well as to unvaccinated, essentially perpetuating the transmission chain.
The biggest source of transmission remains the unvaccinated, to be sure. But, we delude ourselves if we think that being vaccinated is a free pass. It’s not. It’s why I think it’s really foolish that healthcare entities, such as pharmacies, allow no masks and no distancing. Makes no sense. To reiterate, the tiny, cramped CVS I go to has a lot of outpatients from MGH (including the cancer center) who get their Rx’s filled. Many are immunocompromised. They’re all vaccinated. But, they’re definitely vulnerable.
Joshua, does your cvs have delivery? Perhaps that is too difficult in Boston. Many our this way do. I have same day delivery at no charge. I can add anything I Need to the cart, not just scripts
My CVS, which is in Boston, DOES, indeed, deliver. We have been getting our prescriptions delivered since the beginning of the pandemic. Of course, we order other items online that are delivered as well.
Note: We are not downtown. That may make a difference.
I presume Joshua’s CVC is that big one on Boylston Street with 2 floors near the Hancock and Copley Square. Of course, I do not know.
That is what we have here. I sure don’t understand cvs not having a mask mandate.
Totally agree. And I might add one more to you list. Those 65 and older are very susceptible to more severe illness due to the fact
that the human immune system simple does not function as well as we age, especially past aged 65.
I hope the Delta wave is the last of the waves. But hope is not something to rely on, in life, and in public health.
My worry at this point is that the virus is getting increasingly better at evading vaccines. Vaccines still work very well against severe illness, but even there efficacy has dropped at least 10 points in the past few months. We don’t want it to go much below 80%, at least not with the numbers of cases we have worldwide. And, it’s clear efficacy against contracting the virus has dropped significantly, by at least 35 points.
By having >100,000 cases in the U.S. yesterday (with 50% of the testing we did in the spring!), we’re just inviting the next variant to develop. And not just here. The next variant could be worse than Delta.
Oh, I believe it is not a case of if, but rather when. Likely soon imho. And what will that variant bring. scares the shit out of me!!
People who think this is winding down are delusional.
The CVS I’m talking about is across from Charles/MGH T stop. It used to be Phillips Pharmacy many years ago.
They do have a delivery service, but it’s not very good. Twice my son tried having his meds delivered through them and they did not come through on time. Could also be a function of the poor postal service.
In any case, it’s a really nice CVS in some ways. I like the pharmacists and also the cashiers. But, I find the lack of masks and distancing disconcerting when there are so many patients who get their Rx’s filled there. It’s one of two neighborhood go-to pharmacies upon discharge from the MGH, or getting an Rx from a doctor at one of the outpatient clinics. They do vaccinations there (I get my flu shot every fall there) in a tiny corner. When getting vaccinated masks are required. But, then the person 1 or 2 feet away from the vaccination area doesn’t have to wear a mask. Nonsensical.
Yes, I know that one as well.
I’ve gone to that one many times (mostly 10 or more years ago) and pretty much always on July 4. 😉
This is most dishearening.
https://www.cnbc.com/2021/07/30/delta-cdc-warns-variant-is-as-contagious-as-chickenpox-may-make-people-sicker.html
It certainly is. I keep hearing it compared to chicken pox. I was young when I had them. My kids were also. I wasn’t aware that they were more contagious than the other childhood diseases.
I heard on the news this morning that the UK is back open for business and that cases are down 50%. All pubs and restaurants open with no mask wearing indoors. All back to normal, at least that’s the impression I got.
Joshua, could this be us again by fall?
Joshua, your CVS that you posted yesterday (them & now) looks quite large to me. The one I sometimes go to on Beacon St. in Coolidge Corner, THAT is small to say the least. They don’t even carry certain items. Inside it’s about the size of a neighborhood corner store.
Can anyone explain Florida to me? Let me be a bit more specific. I thought that they were only reporting Covid numbers weekly. But on Worldometers, the new cases for the past four days are:
July 27: 12,775
July 28: 16,038
July 29: 17,589
July 30: 21,683
Are these numbers right? Are they reporting a backlog?
Great question. Florida doesn’t report on a daily basis. But once they do report Worldometer and others can sift through the numbers to report what Wednesday’s numbers were, Thursday’s, Friday’s, and so on and so forth.
Thanks Joshua. So these are daily numbers, but they might be from last week? If so, I hate to think what the current situation is.
Good grief. I hope those are not the number of new cases each day
Philip, the CVS store I’m talking about is really small. Even smaller than the one you’re referring to on Beacon Street in Coolidge Corner. My CVS doesn’t carry MANY items, just way too small to do so. It has the feel of a small neighborhood corner store.
You asked about the UK. Its cases have come down in the past 10 days, by about 30%. Hospitalizations are still very elevated in all regions except Scotland. Deaths in this wave have not been nearly as high as in previous waves, but at 75/day it’s much higher than the 5/day they were experiencing at the beginning of June.
UK is mostly back to normal and has been since May. A further lifting of restrictions occurred 2 weeks ago. Masking is NOT mandated, nor are proofs of vaccination or negative tests. But, masks and vaccine passports of sorts are customary in most indoor places. My daughter can confirm that. Also, there hasn’t yet been a return to offices, at least not on a large scale. Travel restrictions also apply and are quite stringent, as I’ve mentioned before.
Philip, the US has been FAR more open than the UK throughout the pandemic, and especially in the past 7 months. Essentially the UK is now where we were 2 months ago in terms of reopening, but with more voluntarily imposed restrictions than we have. So, I was confused when you said “could this be us again by fall?” We’re as open as can be, quite frankly. More so than any other industrialized country I know. The Delta variant hasn’t changed that at all.
Vicki, those case numbers are the daily increases in Florida. Test positivity approaching 20%. >10,000 hospital admissions, which looks like it will break the record set by the January surge in hospitalizations. 108 deaths reported today. That number will accelerate. This is very bad news, and preventable.
If we start comparing the U.S. with other highly vaccinated countries that have faced or are facing a Delta wave, we do quite poorly in terms of hospitalizations and deaths. There’s a clear reason for that: Our vaccination campaign was never systematic. It was “let’s throw paint against the wall and see if it sticks.” Hence, the opening up of vaccines to anyone over 18 long before other countries had done so. What the other countries wanted to ensure before they offered vaccines to everyone was that the >65, but also the at-risk groups 65 group. The U.S. isn’t even close to that goal nationwide for the >65. It’s around 81%, and even among the higher risk groups outreach was fragmented and so larger percentages of those people are unvaccinated in the U.S.
For some reason a sentence fragment was unintentionally deleted before I sent my post. Here’s the complete sentence:
“What the other countries wanted to ensure before they offered vaccines to everyone was that the >65, but also the at-risk groups 65 group, and healthcare workers were very well protected, that is, >95% fully vaccinated.”
C-19 / 8-1 / ready.